A few things to ponder before the Finals begin
by holiday park on May 27, 2009 9:51 PM EDT
31 comments
Now that a Pittsburgh-Detroit rematch in the Stanley Cup Finals seems is certain, the early buzz appears to have the Penguins as underdogs against the Red Wings. In the interest of healthy debate, below are just a few reasons why Detroit could soon become the most depressing town in America. I mean, even more so.
1. Repeating is much more difficult than winning the first title. The greatest athletes and teams can only stay at the top for so long. Partly it's the pressure; partly it's that you can only go so long with a bullseye on your back. Just ask Roger Federer or the 2007 New England Patriots.
2. The secret continues to be well-kept, but it isn't the mid-1990s anymore. Grunge is dead, no one watches "Saturday Night Live", and the Penguins are no longer a flashy team that plays no defense. They get no credit for this, but it's true.
3. Lidstrom, Datsyuk, and all the other walking wounded. The frequency and vagueness of the injury reports surrounding these Red Wings can only be described as Kevin-Garnett-like lately. While Detroit fans have been fairly blase about this, in spite of the fact that no one misses playoff games unless they're legitimately hurt, ever, the absence or ineffectiveness of Lidstrom would create a serious matchup problem for the Wings. The key to defending the Penguins is having enough strong defensive pairs to put out against the Crosby and Malkin lines; the lack of this was what doomed the Hurricanes.
4. Wings fans might have been too busy setting fire to buildings in their neighborhood or voting for Kwame Kilpatrick (or, in the case of bandwagon Wings fans, too busy cheering for the Yankees, Patriots, Cavaliers, Florida Gators football team, and UNC basketball team) to notice, but your team can be beaten. We saw it in 2004 with the Flames, we saw it in 2006 with the Oilers, we saw it in 2007 with the Ducks, and we almost saw it in 2009, when the Wings needed a fluky, should-have-been-waved-off goal in the dying seconds to win game 7 at home against a #8 seed playing a rookie goaltender. The key to beating the Red Wings is fairly simple: play Anaheim hockey. The mistake the Pens made in last year's Finals, and which the Blackhawks are making this year, lies in trying to match the Wings at the soft, Euro, finesse game. No one does soft and Euro like the Red Wings, and when you try to match their skill you play into their hands. The way to beat them is to play an uglier, nastier game while taking care of your own end. Detroit isn't as soft as they used to be, but they've never been comfortable playing this kind of game. If the Pens can be the meaner, more physical team (and they have the bodies to do so), history suggests they can win this series.
So there you go. Just a few reasons why Detroit fans could soon have a reason to wear bags on their heads. I mean, another reason.
The content expressed in fanposts does not necessarily reflect the opinions of the staff here at Pensburgh.com. FanPosts are opinions expressed by fans of various teams throughout the league but may be more Pittsburgh-centric for obvious reasons.
0 recs |
31 comments
|
Email
Print
Comments
(PS – just edited your first sentence because it was made certain about 10 minutes after this post)
Follow the Penguins on SBN @ Pensburgh.com and twitter.
Thanks. Game was still tied when I was writing.
P is for Latrobe.
by holiday park on May 28, 2009 10:22 AM EDT up reply actions
agree mostly with this post with a few exceptions
1) clevland is the most depressing town in the world. seriously the cavs blowing the playoffs, the indians just cant get over the hump, and the brown just being the browns.
2) grunge is not dead
but i think when its all said and done the pens will hoist the cup. they havent played a finesse game in a long long time. they only pull that out when its a sure shot for a goal
" I AM CAPATIN CHAOS, and this is my trusty Sidekick cato. Say hello Cato"
Dom Deluise 1933-2009, Cannonball run
by oldtimehockey09 on May 27, 2009 11:02 PM EDT reply actions
Grunge is not dead
Watch Conan on monday night. Pearl Jam (the greatest rock band of our generation) is playing new material live.
And I still watch SNL.
Success without honor is like an unseasoned dish, it will fill you up but it won't taste good. - Joe V. Paterno
by carolinaeasy on May 28, 2009 8:27 AM EDT up reply actions
Grunge has been dead for years
just b/c one band survives, doesnt mean the whole genre does, and Pearl Jam is hardly a cultural force at this point, especially amongst the younger generations.
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
there is something oddly hysterical about discussing the validity of grunge on a hocket blog
" I AM CAPATIN CHAOS, and this is my trusty Sidekick cato. Say hello Cato"
Dom Deluise 1933-2009, Cannonball run
by oldtimehockey09 on May 28, 2009 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions
true
I would imagine theyre very popular amongst hockey fans
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
I was always more a metal head growing up but there was always a special spot in my heart for distorted guitars and mumblings/screaming vocals. Flannel? Not so much…
Follow the Penguins on SBN @ Pensburgh.com and twitter.
I live in cleveland
hey i live in cleveland, but i hate the sports teams here. Wasnt born here moved here when i was 13. Dad is from pittsburgh. I was born in florida. But yea cleveland sports are bad. And I love being a pittsburgh fan living in cleveland. Im not a huge baseball fan so I dont pay attention to the pirates. But football and hockey im glued. I cant stand hearing every year how this is the year for the browns and the cavs. I love when cavs fans have something good and cant quite(sp) get it. HAH
by OLDSKOOLPENS on May 28, 2009 9:53 AM EDT up reply actions
re: cleveland
I lived in southeastern Michigan for 2 years, and trust me, Detroit is a MUCH more depressing city than Cleveland. Living there is a lot like living in Los Angeles. Except for the horrible weather, the lack of scenery, the terrible food, the blocks and blocks of abandoned neighborhoods, and the significantly greater crime and political corruption. Other than that, it’s a bunch of suburbs and freeways surrounding a lifeless downtown.
P is for Latrobe.
by holiday park on May 28, 2009 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions
different team back then. much softer and less experianced. it will deffinatly be an intresting series. probably 7 games
" I AM CAPATIN CHAOS, and this is my trusty Sidekick cato. Say hello Cato"
Dom Deluise 1933-2009, Cannonball run
by oldtimehockey09 on May 27, 2009 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions
the pens last year were like the blackhawks this year
the pens last year were the blackhawks this year, no expierence in the finals no grit. The pens have plenty of that. And a big test is if Osgood can handle 35+ shots on net. Dont think the wings have it easy this time around. They went 1-1 in the season and that 1 was a come from behind win that ended up being 7-6 with a hat trick from Mr. Jordan Stall himself. If the wings win it will be a extemely hard battle that will probably go to 7 hopefully.( that would make one hell of a final) Go pens.
by OLDSKOOLPENS on May 28, 2009 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions
I was thinking the same thing. It looked like men vs. boys in the Detroit series. But if anything it proves that Chicago is ready and willing to make a run again next year. I was impressed with how well they played throughout the playoffs, even against Detroit.
Follow the Penguins on SBN @ Pensburgh.com and twitter.
Someone get Claude Lemieux on the phone
to mix some shit up!
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
ok
i am going insane waiting for the finals to start and we only found out last night that its this sat. could you amagine waiting an entire week…anyone else?
GO PENS!
I think we are under-rating how good Detroit is. I know we are all on a high coming off the Carolina sweep, but of the 3 teams we played this playoff they were BY FAR the weakest in that they were soft, lacked ligitimate defense, and a scoring threat; minus Eric Staal.
Anaheim played a tough series and got in Detroit’s face, but let us not forget who won that series, a series that could have only gone 6 games in the refs hadn’t “shit the bed” on that disallowed Hossa goal in game 3 I think.
With Dupuis-Crosby-Hossa as a first unit, last year, the Pens had to play Euro and Euro doesn’t work against Detroit, they are too systematic on D. The new first line can play a Euro game (only not as good), but more importantly is designed to play more of a cycling game.
The second line is utterly different and not just because “Bugsy” (Ryan Malone, my old high school team-mate) and Sykora are gone. Malkin is a different man this year. The Talbot-Malkin-Tenks line is the Wild Card this year.
Third line is the same only with Cooke instead of Roberts
Fourth line, assuming Disco Dan doesn’t change anything, is different, in that it is a line with a stud center (Crosby, Malkin, and sometimes Staal) a finisher, and and a grinder, just like the top two lines. Simply put, the forward combos are overall better than last year.
D is also much better, and when playing 7 deeper. Gonchar and Orpik and a ligitimate number 1 pair. Gill and Scuderi (who will be playing his last 2 or 3 home games as a Penguin so savor them) are a shut down pair, and Eaton-Letang is an upgrade on last year’s Whitney and Sydor, plus throw in veteran right-handed Boucher.
And I know Osgood has the rings, but he is where he is ONLY because of the company he keeps. Does anyone really, REALLY believe he would be a Hall of Fame candidate if he played for the Islanders for the past ten years? Be honest. And I know one must have greatest around you, especially if you are a goaltender, to reach your full potential, but I am sorry, I just don’t think he is that good.
Life is about one simple choice, get busy living or get busy dying
I won’t make any predictions for the series but I think that Pittsburgh will win game 1 in a runaway.
Book It!
-David
sixminutecynic.blogspot.com
www.piratesmix.com.
by pascaldupweevil on May 28, 2009 6:27 PM EDT reply actions
Well in response to your blog, I think you need to look a little deeper at certain points that you have made….
1. They may play a “better” defensive style that of years past, but they are far from being a quality defense team that you see more in the Western Conference.
2. C’mon go back and read the press releases and articles after all of the Wings Cups in recent years (1997, 1998, 2002, 2008). There was very minimal domestic violence because of the wins if any at all. That was so 1968….Boston in their recent triumphs have been waaaay worse. Please get your facts straight rather than post a stereotypical belief that Detroit is a war zone with a few stadiums in it. just because your parents may have taught you that when you were a kid because of the racial riots that went on in every city from L.A. to Chicago, to Detroit. Detroit has handled it’s recent championships better than most cities have in recent years…but besides…it’s not the fans who play the games so let’s concetrate on the teams and not the cities themselves…We are all part of this great nation. So if you want to talk trash….talk trash on the teams not your own Country.
3. Every team can be beaten…Detroit has won 4 out of the last 11 cups. This means they didn’t win 7 of them even though they were good in all those years…Just because a team is good does not guarantee anything. this goes for Pittsburgh & Detroit.
4. Don’t ever underestimate the Detroit Red Wings…because I will tell you this…they will not underestimate your favorite team either.
5. The Wings won a game 7 against Anaheim in a close game needing “a fluky goal” as you put it….(don’t know where you get that but whatever), Pittsburgh won a game 7 against Washington by a good margin…but in the playoffs a win is a win and a loss is a loss. Whether you win 8-1 or 2-1 it doesn’t matter.
6. Anaheim even though they were an 8th seed was the second best team in the conference, and is probably better than every team in the Eastern Conference.
7. Don’t underestimate Detroit’s ability to play physical…Now when I say physical, I mean winning the battles on the boards, making hits, & fighting through checks, not the crap that happens after the whistles…That is not being physical that is being stupid since Detroit will not be baited into taking penalties after the whistle like every other team does, and if your team trys that crap…they will learn a huge lesson.
8. I’m not sure you understand what Detroit’s team is all about. This claim of “Soft Euro” style of play just doesn’t do justice to their teams style. For one thing the Red Wings like to play WITH the puck and not chasing the puck. So tell me..if you have the puck all the time are you going to get a lot of hits? Probably not eh? So if you have the puck a lot are you going to have a lot of hit attempts against you??? Probably. So please look beyond the stats to notice what is really going on. Also this “Soft” that people tend to label Detroit is really something they haven’t been since 1996…So what is bad about playing whistle to whistle and not getting in all the crap scrums after every play? What is bad about having the other team take stupid penalties because they don’t retaliate to after the whistle cheap shots or trash talk? That’s winning a game within the game. Ask Chicago how that went for them.
9. Well now to get to Osgood…Once again you are not speaking facts, you are speaking from hearsay…it’s “sheik” to say Osgood is overrated…it’s what everyone says right? He’s only good because of the team he’s on right? that’s what “everyone” says right? Obviously you listen more than you watch. Last year the team defense was outstanding, and Osgood played probably the best hockey i’ve ever seen him play all year long. This year he struggled a little bit…or did he? I watched pretty much every game and saw a lot of holes in Detroit’s defense this year. They gave up a lot of odd man rushes and they turned the puck over in their zone more times than they probably had in their previous 10 years combined. that being said, when you leave your goalie out to dry over and over again…well it’s not going to be good. Come this year’s playoffs. Osgood has been playing better than he did last year even. He is making one highlight reel save after another. He has had 1 bad game in the playoffs this year (which he seemed like he was hurt) and they won 6-5 in that game. All you have to do is watch game 5 vs. Chicago to see how he’s been playing this playoff year….and if you aren’t sold on it then well then you will are just blind. The only way Osgood is getting beat are by point shots getting redirected, and by pucks thrown to the front of the net from behind the net. Osgood has not given the lead to any team in the 3rd period. Only the overtime losses to Anaheim and Chicago are the only goals he has allowed after the second period that gave the opposing team a lead. He makes the saves when he needs too. We had Hasek last year and I hated every minute they put Hasek in net over Osgood. i was so happy when they pulled Hasek for Osgood in the Nashville series, I knew once they put him in that we had a chance to win the cup…with Hasek there was no way. Just admit that the only reason you like to put down Chris Osgood is because it’s the only position that every other team is at or around an even keel with Detroit. Bottom line is…He’s a winner and a proven winner.
10. Don’t think that just because Pittsburgh took care of their Eastern foes rather easily that they will handle Detroit in the same way…Washington took you to 7 games. A team that would probably have not beaten Detroit or Anaheim. Carolina beat the 2 best teams in the East going into postseason both in grueling 7 game series. Sure Pittsburgh played 7 with Washington, but I’m pretty sure the Carolina/New Jersey, Carolina/Boston, Detroit/Chicago, Detroit/Anaheim, and pretty much every other series this year was more physical and grueling than that series was for Pittsburgh. That being said, Pittsburgh will most likely be the fresher team coming in to the finals. So we will have to wait and see what wins…being fresh or the experience of tougher previous series. Only the games will tell us that.
In conclusion I say to all sports fans out there…Have fun, root for your team, root against a hated team, but lets not bash the cities of America…especially if you are an American, but since you probably won’t listen i guess you can keep bashng Detroit in hopes that it will have an effect on their hockey team.
1. It is statements like these that make us Pens fans hate most Detroit fans. Maybe it is due to the time difference or something else but it is clear fans in the west absolutely do not watch E. conference hockey very often. The Pens defense is most definitely a quality D. I only hope that the wings underestimate them as much as you wingnuts do.
2. Agreed.
3. Agreed.
4. Funny, I was gonna say the same to you.
5. You are right, but an 8-1 win is still more convincing than a 2-1 margin.
6. See statement #1.
7. Under Bylsma the Pens are playing a very disciplined style of hockey so I wouldn’t expect too much between the whistles in the SCF.
8. I think you guys are a little too sensitive about the “Soft Euro” thing.
9. Absolutely agreed about Osgood.
10. Once again we revisit you guys not watching East. Conf. hockey. First of all, Washington was the Second seed not NJ. The two “hottest” teams entering the playoffs in the east were Pittsburgh and Carolina. Both NJ and Boston finished the season in horrible fashion so I don’t know where you get the idea that Carolina knocked off the two best teams. Now, Washington is one of the biggest teams in the league. It was a very physical series. Have you ever seen AO play before? Or Washington for that matter?
Detroit has a great team. Believe me, we understand this. We don’t need every Detroit fan to come around and tell us that we don’t know whats coming. That said, your post was polite and well thought out, I hope you continue to come around and debate/discuss the SCF with us.
Re: #8 – I don’t perceive Detroit as a soft Euro team but to be honest I’ve heard it coming from more Wings fans than Pens fans. You have enough big guys throwing their weight around (Franzen/Holmstrom/Kronwall) to more or less shoot that idea down.
I agree with PensFan. You put together a solid post and I’d like to see more Detroit fans sharing similar well-thought-out opinions rather than the “Crosby sucks!” comments that tend to get deleted.
Follow the Penguins on SBN @ Pensburgh.com and twitter.
in #9
the way to spell it is “chic”, not “shiek.”
I only half agree with Frank and Pensfan024. There is an underlying vein of dissent and negative vigor in your post. Your post is lashing out in unnecessary defensiveness, whether it be [partially] fact-based and intelligent or not.
Sure, the original poster took some side-armed pot-shots at the City of Detroit, but it was done so in enough of a tactful manner that it can be read and discussed on a family-oriented site. We have heard plenty of misinformed people take shots at our city, but its something that has to be taken in stride and forgotten, if not altogether ignored in the first place.
I agree with every response of Pensfan024’s, until I get to #10, at which point I don’t disagree with him, rather I’d amend it. The Carolina Hurricanes probably were suffering from some degree of fatigue from having finished two 7-game series on the road. That’s the beauty of these playoffs. You can’t knock a team down a rung because they did what they had to do to get through to the next series in relatively good health and with rest. There are no asterisks on the Stanley Cup. It’s a long tough road, no matter which side of the league you come from.
That said, I’ll agree to try watching more Western Conference Hockey next season if you’ll agree to watch more Eastern. Different styles, I’m sure, but to call one better than the other is just a bunch of smoke.
-David
sixminutecynic.blogspot.com
www.piratesmix.com.
by pascaldupweevil on May 29, 2009 7:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Great replies
It’s a little rough being in the Eastern time zone and having a team in the Western conference, especially weeknight road games when the start time is 10:30. I don’t get to see much regular season EC hockey because of the Dish Network/cable TV packages. Vs. is extra and I’ll only pay for it during the playoffs. The dish doesn’t carry CBC at all (if they do, I still haven’t found it). The only hockey most of us see is FSNDetroit and what little NBC broadcasts.
As for the pot-shots/jokes at Detroit, that we can handle. Yeah,0-16, crime rate, Kwame- we know, hahaha(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5NxOfFE6VI)… It’s the shots at the current economic situation here we’re a lil sensitive about. During the WCF, it was a little disturbing hearing some people being seriously happy that Detroiters/Michiganders are losing their jobs, homes and everything they’ve worked for. They reveled in it. It wasn’t sarcasm either, they were genuinely thrilled. I haven’t seen any of that on Pensburgh yet and I really hope I don’t. That could be why Chief may have come across as defensive. The Wings are a much-needed lift and welcome distraction for us and we’re just trying to enjoy every second of it.
OK, I’m done with my soap opera. The 2 best teams are gonna go at it in about 18 hrs. This will be an epic series. Go Wings!
i highly doubt it would happen here. there are no children on this board and job loss much like cancer is not funny
" I AM CAPATIN CHAOS, and this is my trusty Sidekick cato. Say hello Cato"
Dom Deluise 1933-2009, Cannonball run
by oldtimehockey09 on May 30, 2009 1:07 AM EDT up reply actions
2 things
1. Check out the stats for the pens blocked shots. They are giving up their bodies more than any other team has yet in the playoffs. Considering the wings get most of their goals off of deflections shot from the points, this will be an asset for the pens if they keep it up.
2. PF024 has a point. If you watched the caps series, when AO couldn’t get anything going offensively he became a human torpedo.
replies to the above
I’ve been too swamped with work to reply sooner, but I hope it goes without saying that the potshots at Detroit were meant in a spirit of friendly trash-talking. In that spirit corrupt politicians, Devil’s Night, and the Lions are on the table. But you won’t hear someone from Pittsburgh taking joy in another city’s economic woes; we’ve had plenty of our own over the last 3 decades. And I lived just outside of Detroit for two years not long ago, so some of the people dealing with the current situation there are my friends. So yeah, it’s not a set of circumstances I find funny.
Now that that’s out of the way, we like hockey talk as much as any fans. Though we make an effort to not be as condescending or myopic about the sport as Wings fans are. Fortunately this isn’t hard.
P is for Latrobe.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Certain photos copyright © 2010 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
