Pens acquire Alexei Ponikarovsky from Toronto for Luca Caputi and Martin Skoula
by Hooks Orpik on Mar 2, 2010 10:12 PM EST
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PrintPer TSN:
The Toronto Maple Leafs have a deal in place to trade forward Alexei Ponikarovsky to the Pittsburgh Penguins for defenceman Martin Skoula and prospect Luca Caputi.
The deal will become final after a trade call with the NHL.
Ponikarovsky was kept out of the line-up as a healthy scratch for Toronto's home game against the Carolina Hurricanes.
Ponikarovsky will be an unrestricted free agent at the end of the season and is earning $2.5 million this year. The 29-year old native of Kiev, Ukraine, has 19 goals and 22 assists in 61 games this season and is on pace to eclipse his career-high 23 goals set in 2008-09.
Drafted by the Maple Leafs in the 4th round (87th overall) in the 1998 NHL Entry Draft, Ponikarovsky has 114 goals, 143 assists and a plus-56 rating in 477 games with the blue and white.
Ponikarovsky is big at 6'4, 220 and he's an experienced and skilled winger. Giving up Luca Caputi, who's been tearing up the AHL in scoring, is another blow to the organization's depth -- especially if Ponikarovsky walks over the summer. But there's no doubt Poni adds size and skill to Pittsburgh's wing, which is largely seen as the biggest hurdle the team needs.
Ray Shero has never been afraid to pull the trigger on deadline deals, and this is no different. It remains to be seen if Ponikarovsky meshes with Evgeni Malkin or Sidney Crosby, but there's no doubt that when this trade goes through the Penguins will be better on paper than they were before.
UPDATE: Deal is done as reported: Ponikarovsky to Pittsburgh for Caputi and Skoula
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already a done deal
now lets march to the playoffs and win the cup
by bullsfan24 on Mar 2, 2010 10:15 PM EST reply actions
To be honest, I'm not that keen on losing Caputi.
I guess I can live with it, though.
Hey, an out is an out - unless you're Mario, in which case it's probably two outs. -UtesFan89
Why can't Mendy bust a long TD run? We could use it.
With Feds contract expiring, and Billy G’s as well, is it out of the question (predicting a good showing and chemistry with perhaps Geno) for a logical push for Poni to stay? He is at 2.5 this year…I cant see a huge jump in demands for him…
Could, but who knows if he has interest in the KHL or not.
Plus the Penguins like to sign non-core players to 1 or 2 year contracts. On the open market teams tend to give 4,5,6 year contracts. That’s a lot more guaranteed money that’s tough to turn down.
The immediate focus is (and should be) that Shero made the team better for right now, and we’ll see what happens. But long term, if this is a rental, it might not look so good. Of course, if Poni scores some big goals and helps the Pens deep in the playoffs (like Hossa, Guerin or Roberts did) it’d be hard to argue it’s not worth it.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
not a big fan of this deal
yes poni has skill. however the upside from caputi is in my opinon too much to loose. this team has been built with the draft and teh farm teams. we are now trading that for a better shot to win now. if we win the cup great, however what happens when poin asks for too much and the pens have to let him go.
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Mar 2, 2010 10:18 PM EST reply actions
You trade away depth
If it helps the stretch run. You don’t trade away key pieces. I consider Caputi to be depth. I don’t believe he is a legit top six forward.
to be quite honest i would have much rather seen dups go then caputi. sure caputi may be a depth chart guy now, next year he’s probably a top 6.
" Lord Stanley, scratch thier names on your fabled cup" Mike Lange june 12, 2009
by oldtimehockey09 on Mar 2, 2010 10:25 PM EST up reply actions
I’m not to sure that he isn’t a legit top six forward. At the very least, he’s the closest thing we have to a top six forward in our system besides Tangradi. But, I have faith in Shero. Hopefully he can hang on to Poni…
by Hatt the Moople on Mar 2, 2010 10:26 PM EST up reply actions
I tend to agree
They are serious about repeating and with the cap, their window is smaller than it perhaps was. If they repeat this year or win it all next year that will be worth far more than Caputi…
Caputi is definitely top 6 material for the Pens down the road. Especially when Feds and Dupuis have been top 6 all year. That being said, this isn’t dealing away Naslund. Caputi is going to be good, but Poni brings a new dimension to the top 6 guys. Maybe he fills that Ryan Malone void that we have been missing on Geno’s line. That’s my hope.
Poni won’t bring 1/10 the toughness of Malone, but he’ll still be an upgrade on what PIT has now.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
I was only hoping for about 40%
otherwise he would also be int $5mm per range, and we simply cannot afford that.
My take on Poni is that he’s never used his size and tends to disappear for stretches. Pretty much like a Viktor Kozlov. He’s good, that’s all.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
No idea really but he’s been there long enough that he used to play with some legitimate talent like Sundin.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
I didn’t track him but I don’t think it’s realistic to think that he’s going to explode now that he’s in PIT. He should be better with Sid/Geno but he’s basically a 20 goal guy. Like I said, he did play with Sundin and even last year TOR was 10th in the league in scoring so offense wasn’t the reason they were so bad.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
He played on the first line with sundin and nik antropov a few years ago
by penguins4cup on Mar 2, 2010 11:17 PM EST up reply actions
Lately he’s been playing with Bozak (college free agent centre we have high hopes for) and Kessel (by far our best forward).
Poni definitely has skill and can score, but yes he definitely does not use his size as much as typical power forwards do. That always caused frustration among us Leaf fans, but in general he’s a well liked player and we wish him well. Take good care of him, Pittsburgh.
leaf fan stuck in ottawa, a localized black hole that will suck everything in that area to oblivion.
He is typical underachieving winger that Shero likes to take a chance on. I don’t expect him to come in and dominate. 30 would be nice next year if wee keep him, but you could probably write him in for 20 next year regardless of where he plays.
Agreed. He’ll be fine and if he can score in the playoffs that’s all you need.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
And create some room for Geno. I just want him to be a threat. That is something that has been hard to find for Geno this year.
Right, but as you note below that’s what happens when so much money goes to your Cs. I think this was probably the best option for Shero under the circumstances. Not moving a pick or either of your top prospects is a win for Shero, IMO.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
I’m not comfortable with giving up Caputi, but I think you under-sold Poni a bit….He’s been a consistent 18-23 goal scorer in Toronto the past five seasons, I don’t think it’s unreasonable he could go on a tear with Pittsburgh.
Look at Kunitz scoring 18 points in 20 games in Pittsburgh last season (and 14 points in playoffs) and even Guerin netting 12 points in 17 games last season.
Coming to Pittsburgh playing with Sid and Geno can definitely give a short-term jolt to a player with some skill. And I think that COULD be the case here.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
Maybe I wasn’t clear then. I think he definitely could produce for PIT, but thinking he’s going to go from a 20 goal scorer to a 35+ goal scorer isn’t realistic in my mind. Of course, PIT only needs him for ~15 games and the playoffs so annual predictions don’t really matter.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
I get that and it’s reasonable. All Pittsburgh needs is a little bump over the top since it’s the same group that just won the Cup.
Ponikarovsky’s definitely a better top 6 option than Dupuis/Fedotenko, so like you said, it’s a win for Shero.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
Heh. I’m sure Leafs fans said that, just like fans of Kozlov and Antropov always said. But at some point you are who you are.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
Seems Sheros overall plans with the pens is to bring in average wingers year after year and thats the way its going to be. I can understand the mindset that the Pens window to win wont last forever and hes managing to win now. I am not a fan of this deal though. The only way the pens are ever going to have good scoring wingers is to develop them. (Poni is not one, in my opinion). He trades the teams top prospect on the wing for a rental. Our organization is over flowing with centers and he trades their winger of the future. I dont like this move I hope it falls through. All Caputi needs is to add a little more muscle and hes NHL ready. So who are the Pens top 6 wingers next year? Dupuis, Kunitz, Talbot….I would have rather seen a 1st and Jeffery for Ray Whitney.
Poni is a bigger version of Fedotenko, inconsistent and underachieving, we have enough of those already.
How can Shero do anything but bring in average wingers? We spend $21.5mm out of $57ish mm on our three centers. If we get one $5mm winger, we cannot afford any other legitimate top 6 guys, unless we sacrifice defense, which everybody is screaming about also.. I would rather see Shero take a stab at a guy like Poni who could potentially score 30-35 playing with Sid or Geno, than keep Caputi who needs to add strength and weight. (and who has never scored 5 NHL goals in a season, let alone 23 like Poni)
The strength of our team is, and will be for the forseeable future, down the middle, not on the wing. Unless you are proposing trading Sid, Geno or Staal, we will have “average” wingers. And do you really consider Talbot or Dupuis legitimate top 6 guys, when scoffing at Feds as a top 6’er? Really?
Good point, Ulf. No doubt Poni is an upgrade skil wise over some of the guys that the Pens have had to put in Top 6 forward roles.
Caputi is young and now having success at the AHL level. That doesn’t always translate to NHL production, but there’s no reason to believe Caputi couldn’t be a good player at the top level.
Still, we all know a skill boost to help Sid and Malkin was needed, and like you mention, there’s no doubt Ponikarovsky will bring that. Hopefully it’s just for more than a few months.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
thats why the pens need to develop ingers. The Pens have a ton of depth at center. Sorry I dont think trading away their top prospect at wing is a good idea
by genomachine-O on Mar 2, 2010 10:43 PM EST up reply actions
Tangradi’s got to be considered the top prospect, even though Caputi’s a little more polished and closer to being NHL ready at this point.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
Thats why i considered Caputi the top prospect. Tangradi is still another year away atleast
by genomachine-O on Mar 2, 2010 10:51 PM EST up reply actions
No need to apologize, but even if he would have panned out, we wouldn’t keep him past contract #2 anyway. The money just isn’t there. I hate to become a win now guy, but the window of opportunity is 2014. Filling in holes with legitimate 20 goal guys that have the potential to become 30 goal guys makes sense to me. Especially if they are affordable. If Poni works with Geno, Shero can, make a deal to keep him. of that I am sure.
And there is stilla part of me that agrees with you. If caputi was 6’4" and 220, I would hate this trade, but he would also be firmly entrenched on Geno’s right.
Another Way to Look At It...
You dont get something for nothing…You have to give up a quality prospect to get a quality player.
Definitely. I would have preferred to give up a guy like Jeffrey, but Brian Burke’s no fool.
I betcha Burkie tried to get Tangradi, but obviously that’s a no-go, so he “settled” for Caputi, which isn’t a bad consolation.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
I would've been pissed
If we gave up Tangradi for Ponikarovsky. Alot of upside. Very projectable.
Its official.Anyway Maybe in the morning I wont be so pissed off about this trade, but first thoughts i dont like it at all, Im a huge Caputi fan and that has something to do with it. But Tangradi is at least another year away given how this season has gone for him. They just need to develop some kind of winger. They sure could use one for next year on an entry level deal, when they have 4 or 5 defenseman to sign.
Between this and the Leopold deal Shero killed it. PIT got significantly better for the third straight deadline. I’m not really happy with the Caps being so silent, they’re going to need to do something to get better now. I would have rather see Tangradi go but obviously Shero wasn’t going to let that happen. I think this pretty much cements PIT as the EC favorite again this year, I just hope that at some point the lack of prospect depth comes back to bite.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
by Rob Parker on Mar 2, 2010 11:05 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I just hope that at some point the lack of prospect depth comes back to bite.
Ha. In 4 years when our stars have to be resigned. Until then, we get average wingers on two-year contracts, underachievers who might break-out, or wily veterans who we hope have something left in the tank.
It’s the opposite for us. We have one of the deepest farms in the league but at some point you need to turn that into NHL production. Dominating the AHL is nice, and having all those shiny toys in waiting is nice, but just by the numbers there’s no way they can all play for the Caps so at some point you need to move them for immediate help. GMGM is very risk averse like that though.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
If you aren’t already (I admittedly do not know much about the Caps cap situation) you will find yourself snug to the cap with AO, Jizz, Backstrom, Green and Ape taking the lion’s share of the cap. Then how do you pay the new guys if they pan out?
We have tons of cap space right now. Tons. Like, we could take on 18 mill of annual salary if GMGM wanted to. But next year Semin gets a 1.5 mill raise and Backstrom is going to get a 4-5 mill raise so we’ll be tighter. For the next couple years our cap will be ok depending on what Backstrom signs for. Long term I think the plan is to milk production from cheap prospects (part of the reason they love slow-cooking them in the AHL) and having a steady stream of young players to fill in when other guys leave. I don’t think Semin will be with our core long term so that money will free up eventually. Then they’ll just do what PIT does. Lock up AO/Backstrom/Green/Carlson/Alzner and a goalie and then fill in around the edges. Who is Ape?
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
Varlamov (Semyeon sp?) Simion = ape. Sorry for the spell fail. too lazy to look it up. And I thought I’d start a bad nickname for another cap, because Jizz is priceless.
Well don’t go giving yourself too much credit for Jizz. That was low hanging fruit. I’m not even convinced Varlamov is our goalie of the future. We have ridiculous goalie depth right now so I don’t see us paying too much for a goalie in the short term. We’ll milk their RFA years and keep them cheap and wait to see who comes out on top. If more than one pan out that’s even better and we can move a guy before he gets too expensive. Carlson is the guy mostly likely to throw a wrench into our salary cap in the short term.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
Speaking of underachievers who might break out, you think there’s any chance Shero tries to see if he can get Mueller from PHX for a prayer and a song?
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
At this point I think he’s done. I think the Pens want to have all of Talbot/Dupuis/Fedotenko/Adams in the lineup for the playoffs, so unless they can get Mueller for nothing like you say, and basically shut him down for this season I don’t see it happening.
I suppose we’ll see. Shero’s got the brass of a riverboat gambler, I should know better than to put anything past him.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
With bringing in Poni, we still have one too many forwards. Are we going to go into round robin again for the healthy scratch?
Kunitz-Crosby-Guerin
Dupuis-Malkin-Ponikarovsky
Cooke-Staal-TK
Fedotenko-Adams-Talbot
Rupp in the cold.
Yeah, there’s too many dancers and not enough chairs…..Assuming no more moves are made.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
Injuries. There are always injuries and it is not a bad thing to have a proven NHLer chomping at the bit waiting to get back on the dance floor.
Really? Adams over Rupp on the 4th line. Interesting to see this. I would think Rupp would get the nod over Adams but maybe not. I suppose Adams is a penalty kill guy.
by packallday555 on Mar 3, 2010 12:55 AM EST up reply actions
Come playoff time, Id be very surprised if Rupp is in the press box.
by genomachine-O on Mar 3, 2010 7:15 AM EST up reply actions
Wow, you think he’s done? Guy is way too young and skilled to be done. I think he just needs a change of scenery and a wake up call. It actually reminds me a lot of the Briere situation in PHX.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
Maybe the change of scenery is what he needs, but given the Pens have 13 solid forwards and have shown a desire NOT to trade anyone, I don’t see it happening. Especially with PITT being RIGHT at the cap now.
If they wanted to give up a Kennedy or Talbot for Mueller it could happen, but I really don’t think Shero would do that.
Maybe over the summer if Mueller’s still in purgatory the Pens would be more able to act on it, but for now the
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
Makes sense. I hadn’t really thought it out at all that one comment just stoked my curiosity.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
I’m curious too, he’s highly regarded and would be a nice addition….Don’t see it for right now, but Shero’s never been afraid to pull the trigger if he thinks it’ll work.
But usually it’s for established guys. Mueller would be, by far, the biggest unknown he’s ever acquired in a high-profile deal.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
I don;t know that Talbot/Kennedy for Mueller is anything more than a swap of third-liners. I just don’t think PHO would bite on either of those guys.
Given Mueller’s high-end ceiling, you may be quite right.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
Would love to see Mueller get a chance here. I dont think it will happen unless its in the offseason. Im sure the asking price for him was way out of the Pens league.
by genomachine-O on Mar 3, 2010 7:27 AM EST up reply actions
It may be too rich for PIT to pay right now but I think ti’ll be much lower than most expect. I think PHX is just done with him.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
Between this and the Leopold deal Shero killed it.
I would have to agree. He said he didn’t want to give up anyone from his NHL roster, and he didn’t.
I just hope that at some point the lack of prospect depth comes back to bite.
Puts some pressure on the scouting, huh?. They dug up Caputi in the 4th round and they’re going to need to continue to draft/develop well in later rounds to fill in the gaps.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
Did you catch the post about 3 weeks back on “From the Rink” about where guys were drafted. There is a shocking number of guys in the NHL (60ish%) that were drafted in the first round. The later guys are feel good stories, but seem to be few and far between.
Definitely the odd’s are very stacked against most draftee’s. That’s why the pressure is on. Caputi blew up after being drafted, as did Jeffrey and CPZ. Of course now CPZ is barely on the radar and none of them are anything close to NHL proven.
There’s no doubt some talent is out there in the late rounds, but the pressure is going to be on for Pittsburgh’s staff to ID it and get it.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
Not just the later rounds. It gives basically zero margin for error on your first round pick, especially if he keeps dealing his 2nds. Prospect depth is reaching the point where that’s not as big a problem as it used to be, but the NHL isn’t at NFL level prospect talent yet so it’s still a concern. Especially in weak draft years like the one coming up.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
Prospect depth wise, I think guys like Nick Johnson, Dustin Jeffrey, Eric Tangradi give enough back-fill for now.
Two years out in 2011-12 the Penguins only have 7 players under contract (for $35m though) and after that it’s only 5 players for $30 million. Being as it’s Fleury, Orpik, Crosby, Malkin and Staal they’ll just have to build around it.
The depth aint great, but as you know, there’s enough talent in the core to work it. A good problem to have and not an un-managable one, in my mind. Especially with GMs and capologists having months in advance to etch out these trade deadline deals and scenarios.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
I would rather be in our situation than have some of the crazy 10-15 year contracts that are out there. Keep the core intact and build around the stars. I have full faith in Shero. I also said that about Patrick in 1992. At leat Shero is not playing with Baldwin’s money, or lack thereof.
Definitely. Things are so structured due to the salary cap it’s like all these good GM’s are playing chess or something.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
They are...
It is starting to remind me of the NFL. The good organizations are rising to the top. It will be interesting to see how/if these organizations are able to transition to the next generation of players, and by that I mean in 5 years time, and stay consistently good. The cap creates very little margin for error.
Johnson and Jeffrey don’t really do anything for me. I’d be mildly surprised if they pan out as top 6 guys; I certainly don’t see it in the next 2-3 years. It’s always good to develop your checkers as well but those aren’t the players that are real tough to find on the FA market if it comes to it.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
I don’t see either as All-Stars, but a guy like Johnson has bloomed each and every year. I could see him as a complimentary guy for Crosby/Malkin.
Not a sure thing, but it’s a possibility.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
It’s also about perspective. The Caps have quite a few forward prospects that I think are better than Jeffrey and Johnson, but I’m so paranoid/skeptical that they won’t pan out that I degrade their value. And then based on that skeptical value I probably look down on Johnson and Jeffrey maybe more than I should. I don’t know if that makes sense.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
Totally get that — especially after seeing your boy Bourque live and in person so much.
Prospects are tricky, such a big jump to get up to the NHL speed and also be a productive player at that level.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
Also, for the record, CBo is not F&B's boy
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
Hahaha. Thanks for that. I have a reputation to uphold…
He’ll be a great AAAA player.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
If he’s smart he gives up the NHL dream very soon and goes to Europe where he can actually make some money.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
Agreed, but something tells me he doesn’t come from a family that has to worry about money. He could go do it for a big payday, it just depends how much he likes his family and how set dad left him.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
That comes from your plethora of prospects. You have many, so you are skeptical. We have few, so we are optimistic. Its all about the rationalization.
Exactly. The power of fandom.
Me: “We have like ten forwards that could turn out to be anywhere from bust to great. If only half of them pan out, that’s still almost our entire top 6, and we already have AO and Backstrom. We’ll be fine.”
You: “We have like three guys that might work. But they only have to play with Crosby and Malkin so they don’t even have to be that good. We’ll be fine.”
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
Pens seem to have luck with 4th rounders
Ryan Malone, Caputi, and Nick Petersen (4th round pick in 2009) is developing nicely too.
by stoopidtom on Mar 2, 2010 11:28 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Not happy about losing Caputi. He was one of few potential top 6 forwards in a very thin group of prospects in the Pens organization.
Let’s look at the top 6 prospects now; definetly Tangradi, maybe CPZ even though he may end up being a bust, possibly Hanowski but we won’t know for several years, Johnson looks like he may just end up in a bottom 6 role, and Nick Petersen is a long shot at best. I’ll go more in depth in an article I’ll write after the deadline. I guess well just have to trust shero on this and hope for the best. Poni does have a lot of upside, so I think shero may try to sign him long term. That’s enough of my rants. Good night.
by stoopidtom on Mar 2, 2010 11:10 PM EST via mobile reply actions
It won’t be here, but I wouldn’t be surprised in the least if Army gets traded tomorrow. He doesn’t like the coach and has been unwilling to sign in ATL.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
oh really? huh. i’ll be damned. well, at least he won’t be in atlanta anymore…(hopefully.)
by katielynn906 on Mar 2, 2010 11:55 PM EST up reply actions
Everyone needs to trust Shero. If Caputi went, there was obviously things about him that allowed Shero to part with him, same way he’s done with every other prospect he’s traded. You have to give up something to get something. It sucks losing his potential, but I wouldn’t necessarily say we overpaid. We’ve got a couple solid LW power forwards in Tangradi and Jeffrey, and with all our defensive prospects in the system, we can afford to focus a higher pick on a winger in future drafts. Remember, Caputi was a 4th round pick. Who’s to say we can’t get someone of equal or higher potential in the next two drafts?
Not every 4th round pick goes on to lead the OHL in scoring and become a Top 10 AHL scorer in 2 seasons, but your point is a good one. Shero’s earned the benefit of our trust as fans for the job he’s done so far.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
I know, that’s why losing Caputi sucks. But the reason I brought up that last part is another big aspect of having Shero is that our drafting and development will be much better in the future than it was in the past. Shero loves gritty power forwards, so I’d expect him to draft a very similar style in the draft next year. Jeffrey was a 6th and he’s leading the team in scoring. That’s probably why Caputi went, because I think Jeffrey was being rumored in one of these deals and Shero would rather keep the guy who’s further along.
by lostprophetRJX on Mar 3, 2010 12:02 AM EST up reply actions
Could be, but my guess is if Burke wanted Jeffrey for Ponikarovsky, it would have been done. Caputi’s a better NHL prospect, I think, in terms of raw skill and his ceiling is higher, which is probably why he was in the deal.
But you’re right, just time to re-load with more big, skilled forwards through the next draft.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
Then again, after watching Burke pick Team USA part of you has to feel a little uneasy that he sees something in the guy…
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I’m no GM but if I had my choice between acquring Jeffrey or Caputi, I’d take Caputi ten times out of ten.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
Clearly. I guess it really wasn’t that hard a choice. Dupres and Tangradi are off the table and Caputi is the clear best remaining.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
I think all our defensemen save Sneep as Depaoli reported earlier today were off limits.
by lostprophetRJX on Mar 3, 2010 12:20 AM EST up reply actions
"Luca was the guy they wanted," Shero said. "We had a long discussion internally. That was not a guy we wanted to trade or looking to trade. But at the end of the day Poni was that guy (Pittsburgh wanted)."
by lostprophetRJX on Mar 3, 2010 12:36 AM EST up reply actions
Of course, I wouldn’t be surprised if Caputi ended up being the better player. The problem was Shero was dealing with a guy with exact similar taste, Burke loves gritty power forwards. Was he still with the Ducks last year when we swung that awesome Whitney trade? Cuz I’m sure Ducks fans hated losing Tangradi. Plus, look at giving Burke the player he wanted as a plus in that they’ll maintain good relations for the future. Toronto still has a little way to go before they move out of the “seller” category.
by lostprophetRJX on Mar 3, 2010 12:19 AM EST up reply actions
I think this is a good point you mentioned. The GMs need to keep civil with each other – “I’ll scratch your back if you scratch mine” sort of deal.
GMRS gave up Tangradi for a piece we need now, and if Burke is happy, then all the better. Doesn’t serve Ray Shero to make Burke feel cheated on the deal.
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by Hockey Beard in SLC on Mar 3, 2010 12:22 AM EST up reply actions
Leafs fan perspective
Poni will be missed.
He’s big, he can throw the weight around if he needs to and he can provide strength in front of the net.
Beyond that, he’s a great kid, one of the funniest and nicest guys on the team. I got an opportunity to gather clips at a Leafs practice and Poni was just killing everyone else in the room. He wouldn’t stop singing the beat to “Disturbia” by Rihanna and had the reporters cracking up. He’s a big, happy Ukranian that we got to watch grow and flourish into an outgoing and fun loving guy who was finally comfortable in his surroundings.
It would be nice to see him successfull and happy with a chance to get it done in the playoffs, which is more than I could have said when we traded Hal Gill.
Oh yeah, and dude can put on a suit like nobody’s buisness.
Willing to trade humour for cash, straight up.
Well, if nothing else, Pittsburgh now leads the league in Ukrainians and dudes named Jordan.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
by Hooks Orpik on Mar 3, 2010 12:17 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
No doubt on his talent being a 20 goal scorer the last few years, but what about these rumors of him being soft? I hear mixed reviews on his physical game but I don’t think Shero would have pulled the trigger on giving up Caputi if he didn’t think Poni lived up to his billing?
by lostprophetRJX on Mar 3, 2010 12:22 AM EST up reply actions
Soft
Is an understandable claim, mainly because he CAN throw his weight around and muck it up, but it’s still so far from a night-in night-out performance with him.
As often as you’ll say “Wow, that was a nice power move to the outside to get to the net”, you’ll find yourself saying two or three times more: “Hey, where the fuck is Ponikarovski?”
Willing to trade humour for cash, straight up.
Hopefully being on a Cup contender will have him making us say more of the former and less of the latter.
by PensAreYourDaddy on Mar 3, 2010 12:27 AM EST up reply actions
Ahhh, so it’s pretty much inconsistency? Hopefully being in a playoff atmosphere and being paired with a couple countrymen (I’m considering Geno one for simplicity sake) will drive him a little more.
by lostprophetRJX on Mar 3, 2010 12:29 AM EST up reply actions
It worked
When he was paired with another big foreign dude in Nik Antropov.
Also, I believe he’s tight with Ruslan.
Willing to trade humour for cash, straight up.
"Poni could be a guy that fits with that line," Penguins general manager Ray Shero said. "They (Fedotenko and Ponikarovsky) have known each other since they were 5 years old."
"He’s a good, hardworking winger who drives to the net hard, he has good size, he’s a good player," Penguins forward Ruslan Fedotenko(notes) said. "I feel like he’s a good addition for us."
haha That can only be a good thing, right?
Gimme back my Poni.
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by Wrap Around Curl on Mar 3, 2010 12:43 AM EST reply actions
Luca
Wasn’t the knock on Luca that he is too slow?
If he’s slow on the ice, he’ll never be a good fit for Sid or Geno. If the new guy can come in and play with Malkin it’ll be great. I don’t think we’ll change Sid’s line at all, so maybe Poni Tenks and Geno? I still want to see Malkin Staal Kennedy as a line for a while to see if it would work, but that would sacrifice a third line completely. Here’s hoping for the best!
No, it was just that he wasn’t physically ready to handle the type of game he plays at an NHL level. But give him a couple years to put strength on and he’s gonna be crashing nets and screening goalies on PPs with ease.
by lostprophetRJX on Mar 3, 2010 1:02 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah I think Caputi could stand to improve his skating, but adding strength and going to the net was his big thing. From reports in WB/S he’d been having more success at it this season, and it showed in his increased goals.
Wayne Gretzky had it wrong: 100% of the shots Gary Roberts doesn't take DO go in.
I’m a fan of the move. I wouldn’t rule out the possibility that he may re-sign during the offseason as well. Obviously defense will be a concern with the Pens this offseason but Poni doesn’t strike me as the sort of guy who will rake in a ton of money (although I’d imagine a bit more than his current $2.5 mill).
With that said, I also don’t like trading away depth, particularly a guy like Caputi who was putting up some numbers in the AHL. I hate to make the comparison, but this is how the Yankees get by in baseball. They have no farm system because they trade players away all the time for “right now” guys instead of coaching the prospects along and developing them on the farm.
But as for Skoula, see ya. Nothing more needs to be said.
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I had a night to think about this deal. While I’m as big of a Caputi fans as there is, I’ve come around on this deal. I dont like giving up Caputi, but I cant ignore the fact that the Leafs took Martin freaking Skoula off the Pens. Poni for Jeffrey and Skoula is a deal that wont get done. I worry about the organizational depth at wing, but I cant hate on the fact that Shero is going all in right now. I like that attitude and in a salary cap league great teams dont stay together forever. Hope Poni works out, hes seems to be consistently inconsistent, but then again hes never played with a guy like Geno. Im happy Geno finally got some love from the pens and got him someone to play with. Im just glad Shero didnt trade for Torres.
by genomachine-O on Mar 3, 2010 7:25 AM EST up reply actions
Don't know why you're down on Torres
Dude would’ve been a HUGE addition, an older Ryan Malone. I love him in Columbus.
I am going to miss caputi, but if you look at it as a straight up Caputi for Poni deal I think it works out well for both teams. I’m also happy whenever a guy like Caputi works his way up and gets his big break. I get the feeling he will be dressing every night for the leafs, and for a hometown toronto boy you know this is a win-win for him.
BRENT
The thing about Ponikarovsky is that he’s sort of a prototypical Russian. He’s not Kovalev-esque – he competes night in and night out and he’s defensively responsible (on terrible Leafs teams he’s always a positive player), but he just doesn’t use his size.
He has a good shot but he plays a very finesse game. You won’t see him smashing people in the corners or standing in front of the net taking abuse.
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Another perspective
Don’t you think if Caputi is really that good Shero will deal to get him back?
Let him go train at home in Toronto on a low-performing (but NHL level, rather than AHL) squad, then bring him back to the burgh when he’s lost his baby teeth and is ready to play on a top line.
I like the trade because Caputi hasn’t shown the fit that Nick Johnson, Letestu, or Lovejoy have shown just yet.
That makes less than no sense.
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by Chemmy on Mar 3, 2010 10:16 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
It makes perfect sense. Caputi couldn’t cut it on a high caliber team, but he was a leader in the AHL. So why not send him to a low caliber team and let him develop where he won’t do any damage to the Pens? And since the Leafs won’t be good for a few years, if the Pens need Caputi back for bottom 6 forward duty, then they can deal again. I think Shero is just as good at dealing as Burke.
Bottom line is Caputi can’t perform like Poni ought to. So, we wish him well, and maybe we’ll see him in the future.
The Leafs are gonna be a good team again a lot sooner than you think. Brian Burke is an excellent GM, and he’s already on a solid pace building that team back up. But that’s not even the main point. If Caputi keeps developing well, the bottom line is Burke’s not gonna trade him. Tangradi has made big strides, do you think Shero would want to trade him back to the Ducks?
by lostprophetRJX on Mar 3, 2010 10:23 PM EST up reply actions
What I’m saying is that I don’t see Caputi or Toronto in the same light that you guys do. In fact, I even see Tangradi (from what he did working with Sid in the preseason) as a much more important prospect. Caputi has already had chances to show what he’s got at the NHL level, and rather than let that play out in a Chris Bourque-esque fashion, I’m happy to give up another 4th line potential player for a 2nd line ready player.
The Ducks are also a much different team with stronger potential than the Leafs.
As to Shero, you’re completely turning my comment about him on its head— Shero would be unlikely to give up strong potential to a competitor. But in this trade, he was willing to give up a low potential player to a non-competitive team. As good as you may suspect Burke to be, I just think the Pens and Shero together benefited from this trade and could work something out beneficial for both teams if in the future it seemed it was in the Pens best interest to reacquire Caputi (which isn’t such a rare thing as you guys are making it seem).
Well, Tangradi is a much more important prospect because he’s our top skater prospect. I’m sure no one even low balled Ray with asking for him. Caputi had a few chances, and he showed he’s got potential. The only problem was that he wasn’t strong enough, which is easily fixable compared to prospects who just don’t have the mental game on the ice. As far as HockeysFuture was concerned, Caputi was our third best prospect.
As right now, I would actually consider the Leafs to have stronger potential than the Ducks. The Ducks are a better team right now, but the Leafs have much more of a pool of solid prospects in their system . And Caputi’s one more. I dunno what you mean by sending Caputi to a competitor. But the only way Burke gives up Caputi is if he’s not living up to his potential two years down the road, key words “two years down the road.” If he does live up to his billing, he’ll crack a developing Leaf roster and soon be rolling next to their top prospect Nazem Kadri.
by lostprophetRJX on Mar 4, 2010 12:09 PM EST up reply actions
The only way we get Caputi back is by rediculously overpaying Burke for him. Shero and Burke have the same taste in players, and being how little Shero wanted to give him up, Burke is gonna sit back and enjoy his development unless it’s a deal that makes his team better for the point in the future he’s aiming for.
by lostprophetRJX on Mar 3, 2010 12:26 PM EST up reply actions
One other thing to consider.
Our roster is already really young. This isn’t like we have 29-31 year olds as our core players. We have 21-23 year olds.
Which is probably something that allowed Shero to let go of Caputi easier. But remember you still have to keep developing talent. You can’t always rely on signing guys because if you don’t have to talent pool to let an offseason UFA pass, you get desperate and overpay him.
by lostprophetRJX on Mar 3, 2010 12:28 PM EST up reply actions
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