Will Crosby be the same?
by ipenguin67 on Jan 13, 2011 10:14 PM EST
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PrintUnlike Andy Sutton, I'm not an expert, so I have no qualifications to speak on the long-term effects of concussions, but the thing that worries me most about Sid's concussion is not how long he'll be out (which is bad enough, as he was having a year like nobody has had in almost 20 years), but how he'll be when he comes back. Fortunately, they say it's a "mild" concussion, but my observations of players coming back from concussions is that they often tend to be shadows of their former selves.
Marc Savard has been extremely ineffective this season, David Booth is not who he once was, Lindros went from star to Star (see what I did there?) and out of the league before his time. Keith Primeau was forced into retirement by a concussion. It took Erik Cole a long time to get back into the swing of things. The examples go on and on of players who have had concussions and never been quite the same, or at least took a while to get back there.
Granted this is anecdotal evidence, but it's enough to make me worry. Let's hope and pray that Crosby is Crosby again at least by April.
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Oh Jeez....
For all the research and speculating, I don’t think anyone really wanted to say that one out loud…it’s like the elephant in the room…
I truly believe that the other incidents were much more serious and that he will take good care of himself and come back ok. Hoping….Praying…
Hometown Proud :)
Get better soon Sid...
It is scary to consider and definitely the elephant in the room. However, I remind myself that Jonathan Toews came back strong last year. Poti seems to be okay coming back this year. The hardest part, I imagine, is being willing to take that risk in the corners, in the dirty areas in general, where the beating on the body is that much stronger. Since that is Sid’s game, I sincerely hope he comes back with full confidence and that this truly is a mild concussion that they are being very careful with to ensure a full recovery and return to normal.
If he gets more than enough rest as well as extra time to work out and train during the all-star break (this assumes that his symptoms actually go away before the break), then I think he’ll come back strong. I mean, it’ll probably take him a few games to feel comfortable and good again, but the extra rest should help.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 13, 2011 11:20 PM EST up reply actions
All the players you mention have either suffered severe concussions or have had numerous ones in their career. Since this one is mild and is Sid’s first one, I don’t think he’ll be a “shadow” of his former self.
He probably will struggle at first (relatively speaking) and may not continue the pace that he’s on, but, honestly, I expected him to drop off eventually this season (injury or not).
Nonetheless, this still makes me sick to think about.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
And by “drop off” I mean back to his normal 1.36 PPG career average, for the rest of the season, instead of the monstrous 1.61 he’s putting up this year.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 13, 2011 11:21 PM EST up reply actions
Trust me, there’s nothing I hope more than that you’re right.
"Those goals just rip the heart right out of your stomach." - Edzo
Do you have an example of a guy whose first, mild concussion didn’t lead to a full recovery (assuming that he was treated properly)?
I can’t think of one, and that’s why I have a hard time wondering if Sid will come back as a “shadow” of his former self.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 1:41 AM EST up reply actions
Like I said, I’m no expert on this, and my lack of being able to think of players with concussions who returned to full form speaks less to the actual lack of such players than it does to me not paying much attention to injuries around the league that aren’t major. I wanted to produce counter-examples, but I couldn’t think of any.
"Those goals just rip the heart right out of your stomach." - Edzo
Neither can I.
I think Meester Sid will be okay…this time.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 12:38 PM EST up reply actions
Drew Doughty?
But, then again, there’s a bunch of other examples of other players who came back fine from mild concussions. Doughty is the only one I can think of that has struggled somewhat.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 1:44 PM EST up reply actions
Doughty’s still playing 25:35 a game (7th in league amongst defensemen). He’s still got 22 points in 37 games and has the best +/- on his team.
Is he just not producing points because he’s a young defensemen and perhaps a little inconsistent as he grows?
Or is is the result of being concussed?
"Game's the same. Just got more fierce."
I don’t know, you tell me. What do you think?
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 2:20 PM EST up reply actions
I’m going to agree with the others who have said that the examples you cited were much more serious than this one. Not to downplay the hit that Sid took, because Steckel is certainly a big boy, but fortunately he wasn’t moving at full or even half speed (well, maybe half speed for Steckel) at the time of the collision. Only time will tell, of course, but I’m optimistic for a full recovery.
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by PensAreYourDaddy on Jan 13, 2011 11:39 PM EST reply actions
Sidney Crosby is Sidney Crosby. He’s faced injuries and adversity before, he’ll bounce back like he always does.
Hey, if you’re gonna call us birds you might as well call us chickens.
The universe moves depending on where Sidney Crosby is on the ice - IHeartPenguins
Recently-converted Certified Grabbo lover. GET WELL SOON, SID
Sorry Leafer but not even Sid is invincible. This time he may return to normal (and we don’t even know that for sure), but if he gets more concussions, it could essentially ruin his career.
Any concussion is very serious, let alone multiple ones.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 12:19 AM EST up reply actions
I’m trying to be positive >:(
Hey, if you’re gonna call us birds you might as well call us chickens.
The universe moves depending on where Sidney Crosby is on the ice - IHeartPenguins
Recently-converted Certified Grabbo lover. GET WELL SOON, SID
It’s difficult to be positive.
I can’t imagine how tough it must be for Sid not knowing when his symptoms will go away. In addition, how tough must it be for the person/people who are taking care of him (I assume his parents)? Not only that, but once Sid gets back on the ice, he doesn’t know how he’ll react or if he’ll get back to the level he was playing at (if ever or not for a long while).
Basically, with an injury with a lot of unknowns, it’s almost impossible to be positive.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 12:39 AM EST up reply actions
I’m trying, although It may render me slightly delusional
Hey, if you’re gonna call us birds you might as well call us chickens.
The universe moves depending on where Sidney Crosby is on the ice - IHeartPenguins
Recently-converted Certified Grabbo lover. GET WELL SOON, SID
Haha, it’s okay me too.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 12:41 AM EST up reply actions
That is, it’s almost impossible to be completely positive without being real.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 12:41 AM EST up reply actions
it’s almost impossible to be positive.
That’s a little extreme.
Concussion symptoms are difficult to predict when they’ll go away, but a mild concussion is not the end of the world. The fog clears up. He will improve, it just takes time.
I’ve had a few myself. You feel bad for a few days, make some progress, hit a few bumps along the way and then one day you wake up and go from 80% to about 100%.
Not only that, but once Sid gets back on the ice, he doesn’t know how he’ll react or if he’ll get back to the level he was playing at (if ever or not for a long while).
That’s almost comical. Crosby wasn’t taken off the ice on a stretcher. He didn’t suffer any significant damage. It’ll be fine.
"Game's the same. Just got more fierce."
by Hooks Orpik on Jan 14, 2011 10:40 AM EST up reply actions
I don’t think so.
Skating could cause the symptoms to return and keep him out. I mean, look at the level he was on when he got hurt. I think it’ll be pretty difficult to return to that. It’ll take him more than a few games….if it doesn’t, I will be absolutely amazed.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 12:40 PM EST up reply actions
look at the level he was on when he got hurt.
In some ways he was already slowing down, in terms of being on pace for 50 in 50 at one point. No one is going to score every day and that 25 game streak had to end at some point.
Crosby will be the same player when he comes back. The production might not be at the eye-popping level it was, but is that more of a function that no one puts up 140 point seasons these days or that he got hurt?
I would argue the former.
"Game's the same. Just got more fierce."
by Hooks Orpik on Jan 14, 2011 12:52 PM EST up reply actions
All I’m saying is that it’s hard to be so positive with an injury that has so many unknowns.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 1:29 PM EST up reply actions
Sometimes I forget Crosby is the first player to try to come back from a mild concussion and play the game at a high level.
"Game's the same. Just got more fierce."
Sorry that happens to ya, Hooks.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 2:19 PM EST up reply actions
Look, all I’m saying is that until we know that he’s going to come back and play at the same level he was at when he got injured, it’s hard to be as positive as Leafer.
For all we know, this injury could affect the way Sid plays for a while.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 2:27 PM EST up reply actions
For all we know, this injury could affect the way Sid plays for a while.
Being as they’re keeping him away until he’s 100%, to me, means it won’t be the injury’s fault what happens when he returns. This isn’t like playing on a broken foot or a bad ankle that will slow him down.
When Crosby’s back, it’s because he’ll be symptom free and 100% and there’s no reason to believe anything about his game will change. Will the points pile up as much? Will he continue to shoot at a shooting % way higher than his career average? I don’t know.
"Game's the same. Just got more fierce."
I don’t know.
Exactly.
We don’t know anything, so it’s tough to be super positive.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 2:46 PM EST up reply actions
We do know he’s suffered a minor concussion. Players return to it all the time and lead long, healthy and tremendous careers. Like Evgeni Malkin.
"Game's the same. Just got more fierce."
If there’s one thing I’ve learned, it’s that different people react differently to concussions. It’d be a mistake to generalize.
Once again, we don’t know anything. If he’ll shy away from physical areas for a while, take a while to get back into the groove, look like he did when he got injured, continue the pace he was on, or drop off a bit.
He probably will return to form some time or another, but how can we say that for sure?
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 3:56 PM EST up reply actions
new avatar suggestion for Allie
.
Follow me on twitter, Picasa or at Pens Through My Lens.
by PensAreYourDaddy on Jan 14, 2011 12:39 AM EST up reply actions
Leafer?
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 12:44 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
hahahaha, that is exactly what I had in mind!
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by PensAreYourDaddy on Jan 14, 2011 1:02 AM EST up reply actions
I think that the Penguins are taking this slow for a reason. That bodes well for Sidney who should have ample time to recover. Really no reason to rush him back.
by Littlefield's Legacy on Jan 14, 2011 2:12 AM EST reply actions
Very true. Although this absence might give the two freaks of nature twins out in Vancouver a chance to make a push for MVP/scoring title.
"Those goals just rip the heart right out of your stomach." - Edzo
Guys get concussions all the time and are fine. Booth and Savard are extreme examples, both of their concussions were MUCH more severe to the point where they were down on the ice and had to be stretchered out. Crosby was dazed, but he wasn’t completely incapacitated like that.
Evgeni Malkin suffered 2 concussions during the 2003-04 season (year before he was drafted). Since then, he’s had 0 and gone on to have a successful career.
Crosby should be fine. They’re letting it heal properly, so hopefully the concussions won’t pile up like they did for a guy like Lindros.
"Game's the same. Just got more fierce."
I'm Reading
And listening to what everyone has said from all the experts to everyone here.
I am trying to stay positive. Maybe Booth and Savard are extreme cases. How old they?
Does the age of the player matter?—Sid is 23. Will that help him? Recover to be at
his 100% best?
Hooks and PAYD see it one way; Allie sees it another.
I don’t know but I have this knot in the pit of my stomach.
I pray and hope that Sid returns to be his former self and NEVER has any adverse
effects from this concussion. If not, It will be a sad day for hockey.
Hockey keeps us sane. Life would suck without it.
Let's go Pens! Let's go Canucks!
Crosby for Hart.......Letang for the Norris ..........KesLord for Selke.
And Sid, get well soon!
by PensFanInDenver on Jan 14, 2011 10:28 AM EST reply actions
Hooks and PAYD see it one way; Allie sees it another.
All the players you mention have either suffered severe concussions or have had numerous ones in their career. Since this one is mild and is Sid’s first one, I don’t think he’ll be a "shadow" of his former self.
He probably will struggle at first (relatively speaking) and may not continue the pace that he’s on, but, honestly, I expected him to drop off eventually this season (injury or not).
Nonetheless, this still makes me sick to think about….
And by "drop off" I mean back to his normal 1.36 PPG career average, for the rest of the season, instead of the monstrous 1.61 he’s putting up this year.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 12:42 PM EST up reply actions
And by “drop off” I mean back to his normal 1.36 PPG career average, for the rest of the season, instead of the monstrous 1.61 he’s putting up this year.
That’s 2 different things. If Crosby reverts to his career average, that doesn’t mean the concussion was the reason.
No one in recent NHL history has put up the goals + point totals Crosby was on pace for, Sid included. This injury isn’t necessarily what was going to slow him down.
"Game's the same. Just got more fierce."
by Hooks Orpik on Jan 14, 2011 12:47 PM EST up reply actions
Exactly, which is why I said I thought he was going to drop off anyway, injury or not.
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 1:30 PM EST up reply actions
Listening to Live at the Skate this morning. Rob Rossi was a guest and had some interesting things to say on why Sid’s return is taking longer. It’s his opinion, but it was interesting so I thought I’d bring it over here. First of all, he was not happy that daily updates would not continue and had to say that. But, he did agree and reiterate that the Pens are taking their time and making sure Sid is okay. Plus, he pointed out that this is the first concussion Sid has experienced and that he was being careful. In a concussion, the Doctors and trainers rely a lot on the player for symptom reporting to help them move forward and understand what is going on. Sid isn’t experienced with this and wants to be careful. So, essentially, he implied that Sid is cautious and the Pens are cautious, so there is some extra time. He said more that I didn’t catch since I actually had to answer the phone and work, but that seemed to be the gyst of the conversation. That makes sense to me. Caution is good.
It’s all supposition and we really don’t know much of anything, of course, but we’ll continue to help ourselves deal with the angst by commenting and discussing, at least I probably will :)
Interesting stuff, thanks for passing it on. Rossi would be miffed at no updates — nothing for the media to write and report on. But the truth is, until Crosby makes progress enough to re-start phyiscal activities, there’s nothing to update.
"Game's the same. Just got more fierce."
by Hooks Orpik on Jan 14, 2011 10:42 AM EST up reply actions
True. An update is not an update if it’s just a repetition of the words from the day before. I’d love for the next update (hopefully not too far away) to say that Sid is skating after having passed the other stages along the way. I’ll fret until then, of course, but it make more sense than answering a question whose response has not changed.
Big Ben has had a couple of concussions (I’d venture to say more numerous and more serious than Crosby), and he’s been a really great player since he’s come back from all of them. Ultimately, I think Crosby will be alright. UPMC has a stellar neurology department, and I’m sure Crosby is getting the best attention possible.
Hockey Blogger at Pensburgh.com
As physical as hockey (and football are) I’d be surprised if every major professional athlete in those sports haven’t sustained at least 1 concussion in their lives.
It can be a serious injury, especially if they “pile up” but there’s tons of guys who’ve suffered minor concussions, done the right thing to let it heal and then gone on to have great careers.
"Game's the same. Just got more fierce."
by Hooks Orpik on Jan 14, 2011 11:36 AM EST up reply actions
A little extreme
This is what I call the “over-reaction game”. Listen Sidney Crosby is going to be fine. Concussions happen a lot in not only the NHL but pretty much any other sport out there. When he’s symptom free and returns to the team he might be a little hesitant, but after a while he’ll forgot all about it in the middle of the game, and also he doesn’t have to play in the corners so much, at least shouldn’t have to. Plus I doubt many more people will get in any head shots on Sid unless they want an elbow to the head courtesy of Matt Cooke.
Surprised no one has set up iscrosbygoingtobeok.com yet.
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Follow me on twitter, Picasa or at Pens Through My Lens.
by PensAreYourDaddy on Jan 14, 2011 3:23 PM EST reply actions
Check out my blog for updates on Sid’s injury!
My Thoughts on the Pens & Twitter
"A player's game is a composition. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes a paragraph. Right now, Crosby's game is a novel." -Scott Burnside
by AllieLXXXVII on Jan 14, 2011 3:38 PM EST up reply actions
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