Vote on the Penguins' unsung hero
A handful of nominations were given in the comments section of our nomination post, and so follows a poll. Who exactly is, on a local scale, the most under-appreciated Penguin? The guy with a skill set beyond the credit he's given by Pens fans, and who's efforts make the team far better than typically perceived.
Base his under-appreciation on what you hear from other fans, on talk shows, your barber's stance based on vague methodology, or that annoying neighbor who has an opinion on everything and is always, always wrong.
Polling closes on Wednesday. The winner will be honored in some perfunctory fashion.
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J Staal no doubt
sucks that he is out of the lineup but when playing he is it. Shuts down the other teams top line, plays on the PK and PP. Offensively he was steeping up this year. Gotta be him
Thats what she said! - Michael Gary Scott
Underappreciated = Contribution - Credit
Name—>> Contribution – Credit = (degree of) Underappreciation
Niskanen: 4 – 2 = 2
CAdams: 3 – 4 = -1
Kunitz: 6 – 5 = 1
Engelland: 4 – 2 = 2
Cooke: 5 – 0 = 5
JStaal: 8 – 6 = 2
PMartin: 6 – 3 = 3
Park: 3 – 1 = 2
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Diomedes7 on Twitter
I think he there’s a Pythagorean something or another missing.
by Stephen Catanese on Jan 21, 2012 3:21 PM EST up reply actions
the numbers are subjective
keep in mind, however, that this entire exercise is subjective
that said, it may help to think of this in a systematic way
using a bit of logical reasoning
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Diomedes7 on Twitter
Okay...
Then what is your reasoning behind the numbers? I like what you’re doing with it since it reflects how I thought about the question, too. But after a cursory look I think I’d agree with some of it and disagree with other bits.
Jagr? I don't even know 'er.
You could count minutes played, then subtract # of fluff pieces on that person … the math could work out somehow.
grain of salt
ATOI
agreed. ATOI is a strong indication of how valuable the player is in the eyes of the coaching staff.
again, Fleury would come out on top here—by a wide margin—as would any good starting, workhorse goaltender (Lundqvist, Quick, Rinne, etc)
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Diomedes7 on Twitter
Contribution —>> For contribution, I made a list ranking something close to “how difficult player X is to replace.” Of the players nominated, JStaal is the most difficult to replace b/c he plays in all situations: ES, PP, SH, FOs (ATOI is a rough proxy) and he does it well (Quality of minutes must be considered as well as Quantity). I assigned him “only” an 8, b/c I reserved 10 for Fleury (as much as I like Johnson, the Pens would be in really bad shape w/ Fleury out of the lineup) and 9 for Crosby.
Credit —>> For credit, I considered the player’s reputation in the national media, the local media, and also here on Pensburgh. Of the players nominated, Cooke received the lowest score. The national media appears to believe that he is a “goon” who cannot play hockey and shouldn’t even be in the league. Nationally, Cooke would receive a negative score. Locally, you see a mix of those who buy the national line (there have been plenty of posts on PB along the same lines), and those who appreciate his strong defensive play, dogged forechecking, and timely secondary scoring.
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by Diomedes7 on Jan 22, 2012 9:12 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Yes. He’d have to be, right?
Any workhorse goaltender will be a 10—almost an unfair comparison.
But right behind them would be players like Malkin and Crosby.
That part seems pretty clear. After that, it gets less so.
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Diomedes7 on Twitter
Sounds right.
Malkin gets jobbed so much here in Pittsburgh, he might have had an outside shot of getting a slight mention here. Ideally thats ridiculous, but man there are some joke fans scattered around here that hate on the guy any chance they can.
I’m kind of surprised to see Staal on the list. I more or less thought everyone loved the guy and were thoroughly impressed with his great two-way play. If anyone expected him to be Crosby that’s their fault for being silly.
I voted for Kunitz. The guy puts in a herculean effort night in and night out, yet rarely receives any credit for it by the press or the fans. He doesn’t score the most goals, but he enables others to do so with his physical play and dogged forechecking. He creates time and space for Malkin and Neal to rack up the points.
You could make an argument for Niskanen as well, the guy is just as under-rated around these parts as Goligoski was. I guess people around here won’t appreciate a puck moving defenceman unless he’s named Letang (who’s an absolute beast, btw! SO happy he’s back!!).
Speaking of unappreciated puck moving defencemen, you could easily make an argument for Martin as well. But the price tag puts somewhat of a shadow on that. He’s really good and never gets any credit for it, but he’s also quite expensive.
Looking back, I think Staal was would be the winner four years ago, Adams wins for two years ago, and Kunitz is at/near the top of the list last year (and maybe, just maybe, Ryan Whitney gets the nod three years ago…).
But I don’t think any of those guys fit the bill this year. Yes, there are plenty of times when their contributions are not fully appreciated, but I think most fans have come around. Part of it is adjusting expectations to what is there, and part of it is realizing what actually is there.
I find it particularly interesting that almost all of the guys on the list are defensive players. It’s not surprising, really, since that is often part of the game that fans and the like are sometimes apt to overlook or undervalue, but it’s a commentary of some sort nonetheless. Chris Kunitz is really the only exception, and even he is kind of the “defensive” guy on the top line (especially when he plays with The Crosby and Dupuis).
I also don’t think Engelland is underrated at all. Perhaps this is exactly the point and it will just push more people to vote for him, but if anything I would say he is overrated. He’s adequate, but I am not in love with him the way many people seem to be.
Matt Cooke, of course, is his own ball of pent up wax, but I don’t think fans of the team really underrate him so much as fans of every other team in the league. So he doesn’t get my vote.
That leaves me with Niskanen, Martin and Park. I think Park has been fairly well appreciated, and it helps that expectations were never too high for him. We knew approximately what we were getting with him, and he’s managed to play very well for us. And I think that’s been recognized.
So Martin or Niskanen, then?
I went with Martin, but I think it’s pretty close. The main reason I didn’t vote for Niskanen is that while I think he does a lot of really great things on the ice, and fans are only slowly warming up to him, I also think he screws up often enough (and took long enough to find his groove in Pittsburgh) to warrant some of his bad press.
Martin, on the other hand, plays pretty well through some pretty big minutes most of the time. And his ability to skate the puck out of the zone and also to get into the play in the offensive zone really is something special.
Jagr? I don't even know 'er.
Definitely Fleury
I didn’t wade into the nominations thread. I assumed somebody would mention Fleury. Fleury always gets left out of these conversations. Yes, he gets a fair amount of credit, but you could argue that his reliable play is the reason that we can play Bylsma’s system.
I guess it’s hard to call him “unsung,” but he deserves more credit than he gets.
Out of the guys up there? Easily Matt Cooke. Staal is better, but he gets plenty of credit. Kunitz?… well, he looks much better when he’s next to Malkin or Crosby.
grain of salt
martin and niskanen
martin and niskanen receive the most criticism, and thus don’t get much recognition for their worth. So, I’d say they are the best fits for the “most under-appreciated” moniker.
I went for Kunitz. While he gets some credit, I agree with others that his work opening the ice for others is often undervalued. I’ve often heard it said that he needs Crosby or Malkin, or others in his previous team, to perform. Personally, I think it works both ways and that his work allows people like Crosby and Malkin to do their thing; and, I think Kunitz does it better and with more consistency than others who play the same role.
I VOTED FOR.....MATT COOKE!!!!!!!!!
I THINK HE DESERVES A HELLUVA LOT OF CREDIT FOR THE RADICAL CHANGE IN HIS STYLE OF PLAY!!! LAST YEAR HE WAS OVER-CRITICIZED AND SUSPENDED FOR HIS DUMB AND AGGRESSIVE PENALTIES, AND EVEN CLOSE TO LOSING HIS CAREER; BUT THIS YEAR HE HAS BECOME SEEMINGLY A BETTER PASSER, ASSIST PERSON, DEFENSIVE PLAYER, RUSHER, AND ALL WITH MINOR NUMBER IN PENALTIES…OH, YES, A MONSTER ON PENALTY KILLS!!!!
"He's smiling Like a Butcher's dog!"- Mike Lange
IN MEMORIUM JOE PATERNO...1926-2012...THANK YOU for your life and your impact...you made this world a better place to live....REST IN PEACE!!
...My "C" in support of Sidney Crosby, our Captain!!
by JUKEBOXHERO on Jan 22, 2012 12:30 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Vitale should be on the list
I think that Joe has added a new element to the Pens offense. He is not afraid to wreak havoc in front of the net, and has played with consistency throughout the season. As much as I love the hard work of Matt Cooke and Pascal Dupuis, Joe gets my vote.

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